Chrissy Kirchhoefer and Lindsey Myers: There’s A New St. Louis Catholic Worker! (CCW Ep 25)

In this episode of the Coffee with Catholic Workers podcast, Chrissy Kirchhoefer and Lindsey Myers join co-hosts Theo Kayser and Lydia Wong to talk about the new house of hospitality they are starting in St. Louis with Theo.

Hospitality and resistance to “the filthy, rotten system” are key to the charism of the new St. Louis Catholic Worker community—but so is a commitment to joy, playfulness, creativity, and friendship.

In fact, it was three friends who met through the Catholic Worker who launched the community this past spring, about four years after the last St. Louis Catholic Worker community, Karen House, closed. Lindsey Myers, Chrissy Kirkhoeffer, and Theo Kayser talked about their Catholic Worker journeys and the joys and challenges of starting a new community on the Coffee with Catholic Workers podcast in April. Kayser co-hosts the show with Lydia Wong, but on this episode, he fielded questions about the new community, too.

Myers got interested in the Catholic Worker after spending a year volunteering with the Jesuit Volunteer Corps at the largest homeless shelter in Phoenix. At the same time, she also visited the soup kitchen down the road, and found the atmosphere there much more inviting compared to the institutional atmosphere of the homeless shelter, so after her volunteer year was up, she applied to work at Andre House of Hospitality (Phoenix, Arizona).

“Working on a homeless services campus, people would often be suspended for fights and violence,” Myers said, “whereas we would have a Mass outside and everyone was welcome, even if they’re talking to someone who might not be there. That really drew me in, the beauty of all are welcome at the table.”

Kirkhoeffer first learned about the Catholic Worker in college, and soon began volunteering at St. Francis Catholic Worker (Columbia, Missouri). Those are some of the most joyful memories from her college years, she said.

After touring many of the European Catholic Worker communities with a friend, she went back to college and took a social justice course that exposed her to the social teaching of the Catholic Church. Then, in November 1998, she went to a large protest at the School of the Americas, a U.S. government program that trained soldiers from Central American “death squads.”

“Boy, that blew my mind, just all of these people who were just so joyful, and (they) seemed so alive,” she said. “It was infectious. I really wanted to know what they were doing, and it was inspirational.”

She eventually moved into St. Francis House, then moved to St. Louis during the U.S. invasion of Iraq to start the Carl Cabot House, a resistance-focused community.

All three had family in St Louis, and eventually connected through their mutual interest in the Catholic Worker. Their previous Catholic Worker experience has given them an advantage in starting the new community, Kirkhoeffer said.

One priority in shaping the new community has been to make it sustainable, avoiding the pitfall of burnout.

“How can we, you know, reclaim activism in a way that doesn’t take away from us being our whole selves?” Myers asked. “One of our values we talked about is play or joy, and I think that being able to have that sense of abundance, that we’re not just putting our head down and doing the work, but how can we be playful and joyful and bring that out in each other and also in the movement.”

Another value the three share is the importance of resistance work, Kayser said. “It’s not just the works of mercy, no matter how important those are,” he said. “Our goal as Catholic Workers is a whole societal change, and doing the works of mercy and trying to model (not only) what care for each other looks like, but also what care for somebody in Gaza looks like when our country is providing the bombs that are destroying their hospitals.”

The three have relied on their extensive network of Catholic Worker friends for advice on how to start their community, especially when it comes to the “nitty gritty details”—things like figuring out the legal structure, who owns the house, and so on.

The Los Angeles Catholic Worker sent the community a card with words of wisdom, Myers said. “‘You do something, and you fail, and then you learn, and you do it again,’” Myers recalled the card saying. “We are an experiment, and we’re trusting in the Spirit, and there’s noperfect or right way to do something, but we trust our love for each other, and that the love of liberation will continue.”

Play the episode or read the transcript below. Please note that the Elizabeth, NJ, Catholic Worker has moved locations since this episode was recorded in January 2024. For current contact details, see their listing here:

Episode transcript

The following episode transcript was autogenerated by AI from the audio transcript and subsequently reviewed and lightly edited for accuracy and clarity. Filler words (ah, um, like, etc.) and false starts have been removed to improve readability.

[music]

Theo Kayser: Welcome to Coffee with Catholic Workers, a podcast made by and for Catholic Workers. I’m Theo.

Lydia Wong: And I’m Lydia. We’ve both been a part of the Catholic Worker for the last decade, and we’re excited to bring various conversations with Catholic Workers from around the world.

Theo Kayser: On this episode, we’re joined by Lindsey and Chrissy who are helping start a Catholic Worker hospitality in the St. Louis area. We’ll hear a bit about their personal Catholic Worker journeys, and then some of our vision for the new St. Louis Catholic Worker.

Lydia Wong: So, we’ll go ahead and get started with all three of them.

Theo Kayser: Well, Lindsey and Chrissy, welcome to Coffee with Catholic Workers. I am very excited to have you all here, finally joining us. Why don’t we start off like we usually do, and you all can tell us how you found your way to the Catholic Worker. And then, how did you find yourself from that place to wanting to start one in St. Louis? And you all can arm wrestle about who goes first.

Lindsey Myers: Okay, I guess I’ll go. Well, I was a Jesuit volunteer in Phoenix, and I worked at the biggest shelter in Phoenix, doing intakes for case management for folks. And then, I had these friends that worked at the soup kitchen down the road, and I would go over there and have lunch with them. Anyhow, I really liked it over there. I didn’t like the case management scene because I felt like there was a disconnect between the desk and the person in front of me, and a lot of people would avoid clients on the way to work, whereas I would go through the unhoused campus and say hi to everybody. I liked being friends with people and that kind of thing. So, after my Jesuit year was over, I interviewed to work at this place called Andre House, a house of hospitality where we did showers, clothing, laundry, and all that kind of thing.

I didn’t know it was a Catholic Worker until I got there. They’re kind of big, so we fed five to seven hundred meals a night and did a bunch of showers, a clothing closet, and we had a men’s transitional house. So we were doing a lot of things—and an office with hygiene, and a phone, and all sorts of stuff like that. I kind of learned about the roots of the Worker, of Andre House, when I got there and realized that Dorothy Day and Peter Maurin were big inspirations to the priests who started it. Our motto was “the open door,” which is a very Catholic Worker aesthetic or I guess mantra is a better word for it.

Once I was there, I read The Long Loneliness—or maybe I found out about the Catholic Worker while I was a Jesuit volunteer and read The Long Loneliness while I was there, I can’t remember because all those years merge together, but then I kind of began to read, and kind of also see the disconnect between Andre House, where I was, and kind of the work that the Catholic Worker was doing, but then also the kind of connections in the sense of the spirit of hospitality, and acknowledging each person as a person, and that everyone has different needs, but all are welcome, and that wasn’t something that working on a homeless services campus, people would often be suspended for fights and violence, and whereas we would have a Mass outside and everyone was welcome, even if they’re talking to someone who might not be there, and that kind of thing, and that really drew me in, the beauty of all are welcome at the table, whereas the government, that wasn’t the case. If you didn’t have a certain ID or certain thing, you couldn’t get in, and there were all these restrictions where Andre House, if anyone could show up, and so that’s kind of how I found myself there, and then yeah, that was the other thing, or does Chrissy want to go, or?

Lydia Wong: How did you make your way then to eventually thinking about starting a Catholic Worker?

Lindsey Myers: Yeah, well that’s a journey, process, so I, so Andre House is interesting too, in the sense that like, I think a lot of, every worker does something different, well they have like people who do service years, so they have this, they have some staff so to speak, but generally it’s like people don’t stay more than a year, and I stayed two years, because to me I was like, this is what I want to do, like why would I do anything else, but I didn’t really, I knew that there were other Catholic Workers, but this was the place that I found home.

So afterwards, I was kind of disgruntled with a lot of, how do I say it, you know, 70 hour weeks we were working, but then also seeing the same people, like you know, encountering folks down on the street, just the systemic level of poverty, like folks don’t have anywhere to go, so they’re going into like a detox facility, but that’s not what they need, they can’t afford anything, waiting for months for social security, just like the same problems over and over, and so I wanted to spend time like thinking about like the roots of poverty, and like why—because I saw on this individual level that I was just like, was so burnt out, and was trying to like be a savior and do everything, but like I couldn’t do it. And so I got a degree, I went and studied like social justice in Chicago, actually, and then after that was doing some organizing, and found myself in Florida in 2020, which was a whole interesting life there, but then was also just disgruntled with the disconnect of people….

I was organizing churches to do some housing reform, like trying to get affordable housing trust funds, and trying to get police trained in mental health crisis response—this is right after George Floyd’s murder—and Florida isn’t ready for, you know, defunding the police, but the police were training themselves in how to handle mental health emergencies, and so we got NAMI, the National Alliance of Mental Illness, to train them, and so we won that campaign, and it was really awesome, and also me working 70 hour weeks, you know, crazy, in 2020, but then feeling like even the churches connected to this, while some of them had experienced poverty, or racism, or several things with the police, or even like dealing with housing issues, like I still was, the most of the people I was seeing on the day-to-day basis were people who were housed, and I felt like there was a, like for me personally, I wanted to be both like have my hands in the work, as well as like doing resistance, and so I think that kind of led me back to St. Louis.

I have my clan lives here, and then I have a good community here, and I was ready to kind of settle in a community, and like want to devote my time and energy to a community, rather than like hopping between like because I’m from Nevada, but I was like hopping into all these spaces, and to me, I felt like if I wanted to do resistance, or organizing, or really be present to like suffering in a community, like I wanted to root myself there, and this I was kind of discerning between St. Louis and Chicago, but I ended up in St. Louis because it’s a little slower paced, and my twin lives here, and so yeah, after taking some time, I, like a theme in my life is kind of taking care of the world, and carrying the world on my shoulders, but not always tending to my own being, you know, or you could call it white saviorism, you know, all sorts of things, but I needed to like discern who I was apart from loving the world, and caring for the world, and so I took some time as just like worked as a barista, and did the Ignatian exercises, and me and Theo became friends, and went to Sugar Creek, and different things, but did a stint like doing chaplaincy in a hospital and stuff, but like kind of for me, it was, I had this moment, I was reading Mutual Aid by Dean Cade, and like in chaplaincy, and exhausted, but also just like being like, this is what I want to be doing, like I want to be like tending to the suffering of the world in this direct way, but also like resisting it, and like, and as well as with this like spiritual lens of like of sustainability, and letting God be really present in the work, and so, yeah, I think then I texted Theo, and I was like we should, you know, I was looking at  houses and stuff, and trying to figure it out, and then he kind of connected all three of us together, because Chrissy had a house that needed a lot of work, and kind of that was the beginning of it, but it was really just like listening to kind of like I think I was trying to find who you need to fit into like a job, and it’s like, but this is a vocation, and like, where do, who, kind of how do I want to live, and how do I want to be present there, so that’s, and then we kind of all connected, and have been kind of meeting and discerning ever since, but yeah, I hope I answered clear enough.

Theo Kayser: Yeah, thanks. What about you, Chrissy? How did you find your way to the Catholic Worker?

Chrissy Kirkhoeffer: It’s an interesting question. I know it’s like kind of the basis of the Coffee with Catholic Workers, and it’s interesting of what emerges of what draws one in at different times.

I first learned about the Catholic Worker when I was in college studying social work, and I think one of the professors I had was comparing Dorothy Day and Jane Hall, so kind of somebody motivated from a faith perspective, and then also one who kind of more within a government, working within the system a bit. So I had gone to the Catholic Worker in Columbia, Missouri during my college time, more like as a volunteer with some youth groups, and I feel like it was some of the most joyful moments, or at least the most memorable in my college years, in terms of going and sharing dinner, and having people coming out of prison, and teaching how to play spades, and it was just like these joyful tables of bringing people around, and kind of got my heart excited about what it was I wanted to do, but it wasn’t until I’d gone for a backpacking trip in Europe, and had gone with a friend who was moving into Karen House in St. Louis, and then we wrote to some of the Catholic Workers in Europe to see about hospitality there, and then ended up staying at quite a few Catholic Workers in Dortmund, Germany, so some of my first hospitality experiences were in the Catholic Workers there in Europe, so that was kind of an interesting perspective to have.

After coming back from that trip, I had my last year in college, and took a Just Faith program at the Newman Center, and so got to understand the best-kept secret of the Catholic Church, the social encyclicals, and different things, and started going by St. Francis House there in Columbia, Missouri more frequently. It was really kind of like a pivotal turning point by going to the School of the Americas for the first time in 1998, in that November. Boy, that blew my mind, just all of these people who were just so joyful, and just had, like, seemed so alive, and it was just, yeah, it was infectious. I really wanted to know what they were doing, and it was inspirational.

I was finishing an internship at the state psychiatric hospital in my social work studies, so I was kind of going down the path of what I knew I didn’t want to do, but trying to go into the path of what it was I wanted to do. It was also at that time that the United States was involved in Operation Desert Fox in Iraq, and so was bombing the p[eople in Iraq, and also the time of Bill Clinton’s impeachment, and just kind of coinciding, and Steve Jacobs, the Catholic Worker in Columbia, Missouri, had returned from a trip to Iraq with Voices in the Wilderness, and was sharing his story or experiences with the people there, and so it just felt like coming home, or just an awareness of the world as opening to my eyes, and not just the ways of the world, but also what people were doing to combat that.

As I was studying social work, a big theme that I was noticing was how much money was going to militarism, and coming from St. Louis where Boeing and McDonnell Douglas was a large employer, there was a saying about equating our way of life with McDonnell Douglas, and protecting that way of life, and so that was really resonant to me, just knowing social work being a field that not having enough resources, and just not wanting to go and work within the system, and so I decided to move into the Catholic Worker there my last semester in college at St. Francis House, and the hospitality that we were doing there was largely with Vietnam vets and different veterans, so it was just this really clear connection of the impacts of war and militarism, and it was also at that time that the state of Missouri was doing a lot of executions, so there was a lot of opportunity for engagement, a lot of protests in the streets, and people coming together and taking action, and it was just starting to discover what it was I wanted to do with my life, and yeah, it kept me at the St. Francis House there, and I guess one of the big parts of that too was doing the hospitality and also doing the resistance, and it felt like a real firm grounding, and it was also just so joyful, the people doing it with, of just feeling so alive and encouraged and finding community and finding family, and yeah.

It was leaving the Catholic Worker in Columbia and moving back to St. Louis when the shock and awe campaign was happening in Iraq, and focusing on Boeing and the smart bomb productions and different things that had me rooted in St. Louis, and then leading us to start the Carl Cabot House here, which was more kind of a community of resistance and focusing on aspects of resistance and building community.

And I guess the second part of the question was, what has drawn us to starting this community? So I guess I also say that St. Louis is my hometown, and so kind of similar to what Lindsey was saying about rootedness, it feels really important to take claim to space and not like in a colonizer way, but the importance of, we can protect what it is that we love, and so the importance of really rooting into a space, and it felt important, this being a hometown and also being a place where so much destruction has come out of.

We’ve had Monsanto World Headquarters, Boeing, Peabody Coal, here at this intersection of the rivers, the confluence, and so I think sometimes really being challenged by the work, but just also recognizing the importance of trying to bring about healing to some of these structures and to the people that they impact.

So I guess also, too, going back to what Lindsey was saying, so I had purchased a house here some time ago with the intention of it being a Catholic Worker, and chipping away at it, pulling plaster out, five gallon buckets, one at a time, and still taking on a lot of the work of this house, but having that intention for community. So that’s, yeah, finding Theo and Lindsey in the community and now just kind of trusting and leaning into that beloved community that we’re trying to build.

Lydia Wong: So it’s super exciting to, like, I don’t know, I remember in starting a community it being super exciting to sort of dream about like what community could be or what it could look like, because sort of sky’s the limit when you’re first starting out. What have been some of the things that have been exciting for you all to think about and dream about? This is including Theo, I suppose, as well.

So I’m curious about what some of the dreams are, but then also what have been some of the things that have been sort of difficult to work out? Like the things that have taken some deep conversation to be like, okay, if this community is going to go, figuring out how you all as a trio agree or disagree and how that works for you.

Chrissy Kirkhoeffer: Who’s taking it? Maybe I’ll just start by saying it’s like sometimes at the doctor visits and they ask like, are you having any of these symptoms? I feel like we haven’t really been having, or my experience, we haven’t had any hard conversations or hard goes to start with in terms of really trusting in each other and the visioning and certainly knowing that some of those challenges await us, but just starting out with a good bill of health, I think, going forward. I just wanted to start and say that.

Lindsey Myers: Yeah, I mean, I think what’s been exciting is I think all of us have had our time in the movement in one way or another, and I think having come from different communities and different experiences, being able to put our brains together and our hearts together and kind of be like what worked and what didn’t work, and I think all of us experienced a level of like burnout and unsustainability in the movement, and like I think what’s been really radiating through my spirit is for all of us to be like, how can we make this sustainable in the long haul? Like how can we, you know, reclaim activism in a way that doesn’t take away from us being our whole selves and the folks that, you know, the hospitality that we’re doing and others being their full selves, and I think that’s been really exciting.

One of our values we talked about is play or joy, and I think that being able to have that sense of abundance, that we’re not just putting our head down and doing the work, but how can we be playful and joyful and bring that out in each other and also in the movement and the giftedness of imagination and creating and just not being so like, oh god, you know, we’re so exhausted, but what does it look like for us to really take care of ourselves and take care of the community in a way that is holistic and sustainable, and I think one of the things we’ve talked about is the beauty of when Peter and Dorothy started, like it was a house taking in someone, like, you know, the Christ room, right, the approach that everyone would have a Christ room in their home, and I think for us, we can take in a couple folks, like we’re not trying to save the world, but how can we really try to be intentional in the work in that space, so that’s been really exciting for me and just joyful to think about dreaming together in a way where we’re, you know, with Maslow’s hierarchy, we’re not just addressing the baseline, but we’re addressing our spiritual needs of joy and play and fun and the work as well, so, yeah, I don’t know.

Theo Kayser: Yeah, and I think we’re lucky, too, because we have like in many ways like a similar vision I think, and we just like each other and like get along too, I think that helps, like we’re kind of friends and enjoy each other’s company, but yeah, like Lindsey was saying, this idea of not just like burning out, there’s a lot of people who come and go from the movement, which is fine in its own way to come for a year or two or three, and Dorothy writes about that, but that, like yeah, we want to be doing this for the long haul, like Lindsey said, vocationally.

When I was living at the Los Angeles Catholic Worker, I was supporting Black Lives Matter LA weekly outside the DA’s office, and they would say very regularly, we’re not going to stop racism this year or this decade or even in our lifetimes, and so we need you to be here as part of this resistance, as part of this fight for a lifetime, so it’s not great if you come to every single event. We don’t want you to come to Black Lives Matter LA events, don’t get me wrong, but if you come to every single thing for a year and then we never ever see you again for the rest of ever, that isn’t a win, and they would say that regularly, and so that’s something I took with me and that we’re all on the same page about.

And from all of our stories too, I think it helps that we all have this vision of the importance of Catholic Worker resistance to the filthy, rotten system. That’s something we really believe is an important part of the work. It’s not just the works of mercy, no matter how important those are, but that it is a revolutionary movement. We named our newsletter In the Shell of the Old, which is a throwback to the industrial workers of the world, the anarchist union that Dorothy Day and Peter Maurin would quote, and that’s really our goal as Catholic Workers, is a whole societal change and doing the works of mercy and trying to model what care for each other looks like, but also what does care for somebody in Gaza look like when our country is providing the bombs that are destroying their hospitals too, and so I’m glad we’re all on the same page about that, and as we’ve been trying to figure out getting a house of hospitality going, we have been trying to be intentional about doing that kind of resistance work, whether it’s going up to the marches here in St. Louis or blocking a Boeing factory with folks here because they’re making those bombs in the St. Louis area that are destroying Gaza hospitals, so all three of us have been out there blocking the entrance to Boeing with other people, and we went down to Cop City to support activists there, and we joined all the other Catholic Workers and protested in Madison this past March, so yeah, I think that’s something we all really value, and I’m glad that I’m starting a community with folks who share that vision.

Chrissy Kirkhoeffer: I feel like there’s a lot of trust in each other built into it that makes the process quite easy, in terms of having past experience but also bringing it in with a fresh start in some sense, and I was really encouraged about a year ago when we were meeting and such, and it was just like, come on, let’s just do the work, do the works of mercy, and that we can trust each other and trust that we’re going to show up and really center the work and the holiness in the work itself, and to make it invitational to pull people in, I think having a rich Catholic Worker history here in St. Louis, but there’s still so much support around that work, and so it’s also, we’re leaning into that community and also centering the work that there’s so many others who are so excited and wanting to get engaged in that work, and so that’s a real impetus as well, kind of an exciting time.

Lydia Wong: So that’s also exciting that you all are able to do some of the work even before having a house of being engaged in resistance, being engaged in sort of communal practices, even without actually being together yet. Let’s ask some questions about the nitty gritty details, though. How are you going to get a house? Are you going to use the house that you have, Chrissy? What’s the plan of getting a house of hospitality? How do finances work? All these things that sort of sometimes get glossed over in these houses up here.

Lindsey Myers: Definitely. I would say I don’t necessarily think we’ve had any hard, oh my gosh, crazy conversations, but the harder ones have been that discernment piece of what the hell are we going to do? We just decided maybe a month ago, a month and a half ago, that we’re looking at buying a house, or hopefully inheriting one if someone will give it to us, but that Chrissy’s house needed a lot of work, and we were worried we would drain resources with it, both our resources, but then also just financial weight. It was a lot. That was a conversation to have. We had to look up grants and see is there a way to fix the house? Just all of those little things of trying to, and then do the math of how much certain things would cost and what’s possible and all of that. I think we had to do some research there and suss that out, but then also, now we’re just talking even with putting our newsletter out. We mailed it all to the Karen House folks who got the Karen House newsletter, and we mailed it out and put a big letter there asking for money for us to hopefully buy a house. Right now, we’re just trying to fundraise, and out of hopefully abundance, we’ll get enough for down payment. That’s where we’re working towards. Even that, it’s the timeline of how to get that amount and what that looks like. It’s a whole thing. There’s a lot more in there, you guys. There’s the whole conversation about who owns the property and all of that, but what’s beautiful is Theo has traveled around a lot and knows a lot of Workers, and so just having conversations with how other people have done it and just knowing who owns the house. At Emmaus House, Libby, and how you guys do it, and then Cherith Brook and just different ones, we’ve looked at different models of how to go about it. We used the Bloomington’s guide, so we got a bank account with our name on it as a business bank account, and they helped us with that and shared their info on how they started theirs financially and who owns their properties. Really using the wisdom of the elders and people who have done it before us has been really a beautiful gift. We’re not in this alone. It’s just beautiful, too, of even the checks we receive or the notes we receive from people. So, LA sent us money and a beautiful card and shirts and just this sense of this is so much bigger than us. This is a movement, and I’ve been really just encouraged by the bounty there of people giving what little they have and God blessing it and it turning into the loaves and the fishes multiply. We’re in the multiplying stage right now.

Theo Kayser: I don’t know how interesting all the nitty-gritty details are. Like Lindsey was saying, I’m a Catholic Worker nerd. I like to go visit Catholic Workers and sit in on their business meeting if I can, and often they’re like, you’re only here a week. You don’t have to come to that meeting. I want to know how to do this stuff. People sometimes say I should write a book, but I don’t know who would read the book about Catholic Worker meetings necessarily. We’re not totally set on this, but we are technically a religious order is kind of how we have arranged ourselves in a legal manner, but don’t tell your IRS friends too much about that. Might be a good idea.

So yeah, we’ve been sending out newsletters, bag letters just to anyone who will listen in the St. Louis area, whether it’s a parish or a cool sounding office at the Archdiocese or somebody who signed up for to get notifications from our email list or social media and stuff. It’s been, money’s been trickling in. We’re not going to get rich. We’re not going to be able to buy a house outright for cash or anything like that, but folks have been supporting us and like Lindsey was saying, that does feel really good.

Chrissy Kirkhoeffer: I appreciate Theo kind of encouraging us also to document this process too. Just how we’ve been going about starting a Catholic Worker and pulling in from some of those resources of people who have done it before, but also being able to trust in ourselves that we are trying to make that something new that’s adaptable to our specific place and time and what we see the needs that are around us and also what makes us feel really alive. I think of course we all have different gifts, but that’s trusting in that as well in that process.

Lydia Wong: St. Louis has a very, very long history of Catholic Workers. I actually just met somebody in Chicago who randomly had stayed as a child in the St. Louis worker, but I don’t know which one yet. Anyway, there’s such a rich history there. What are some of the things that you’re pulling from that or in what ways has that history impacted you all in your process, either being helpful or maybe not?

Theo Kayser: I mean, I am super grateful for the Catholic Workers that came before us. Karen House, Cabot House, Cass House, all the different satellite locations that they had over the years and stuff. Because it was and it is very much just plug and play on a certain level. There’s all these people who remember those Catholic Worker houses. They know what the Catholic Worker is, because it’s not always something that’s easy to explain to somebody who has no idea what it is. So they remember it. They’re excited about it. People have been emailing us. I had coffee with somebody the other day who was like, yeah, we used to cook dinner at the Karen House and just let us know and we could cook meals, even if it’s just for you Catholic Workers, we’ll cook for you. And it’s just people who want to be our friend just because Karen House and Cabot House and all the rest were so cool and had such good reputations. And even, you know, we’ve even had like fancy-titled people with the Archdiocese reaching out to us because they remember it. And so, yeah, I’m really grateful for the road that we are still able to walk on even after they left us.

Chrissy Kirkhoeffer: Yeah, it kind of comes to mind that sitting around the table drinking coffee and it’s been a lot of that and welcoming people in. We’ve been having a series of potlucks, monthly potlucks and doing some roundtable discussions, too. Yeah, again, kind of centering the work and making it invitational. There is so much support in St. Louis, I feel like we’re also kind of at the coming-out stage, too, that we’re in an early phase in St. Louis and just getting word out. And so that’s exciting, like the possibilities. And I guess I feel like it’s a challenge in some ways because I’m so used to planning and having it concrete and really leaning into the Spirit and just putting prayers out there to St. Joseph and asking others, too, in terms of finding a house. And it just is really exciting to just know that there is that support and just to also not know what shape it’s going to take in many ways and just to try to be in the process itself and not so much the outcome.

And again, centering the work and it’s all about building relationship and sometimes that takes time because you have to know what people’s passions and excitement and skills are. And so we’re kind of just feel like broadcasting seeds out into the wider community. And then also feeling the support in terms of the Catholic Worker Movement, not just in the U.S., but worldwide and to know that we are in that movement, and it’s a beautiful one. The work that is needed is universal. That’s so very Catholic, but also that it is work. And so we’re trying to pull people into the work and center that work.

Lindsey Myers: I think, too, the spirit of resistance that comes before us. It was so random, at some point, either when we were on the resistance retreat in Madison or I don’t know. At some point, I realized one of the first resistance retreats was that maybe even the first one was with Boeing. And I didn’t even know that. And then Chrissy’s like, yeah, it was the first one or whatever with Boeing. And just that that is the spirit that comes before us and the fact that we were all there now saying you coming to work is killing children. And that we’re going to stand here and say, please do better for yourselves and for our community. That is just powerful that that comes before us.

And even, too, with Ferguson and Theo living at Karen House shortly after Ferguson uprising and his experience there. Me and him briefly looked at that potential house in Ferguson and just talked through that. And I think that I just believe that we’re like that us moving forward in this is in the spirit of liberation that has come before us of the Workers that have been here before.

And then, too, me and Chrissy went up and met some of them, former Workers that are living in Spanish Lake and have a little goat farm and met the goats, and me and Chrissy separately both really want goats. Just the beauty of we should really reach out with milk and learn to goats.

I stayed with Brian and Betsy the Strangers and Guests farm in Iowa for a couple months in between moving to St. Louis. Both of them, I feel like, really formed me when I needed to was lost and needed to gain my sense of self again. But just the joy, too, of coming back to the land and the fact that the Workers before us, that’s where they ended up is tending to the goats on the land and figuring out ways to tend to it. That is the roots of where we’re coming from and that’s where we want to go. And I think that’s the gift of the Spirit, I think, in all of this. So it’s really exciting.

Lydia Wong: Well, let me know if you get goats and we’ll come and visit you. Mostly to see the goats, but also, you know, to see all of you.

So, I feel like a lot of times people who are interested in the Catholic Worker do have this curiosity of how would they start a Catholic Worker if they were interested. And I think for all of you, the process is a little bit different because you all have a lot of familiarity with the Catholic Worker and so you’re not coming at this from scratch. But I’m curious if anything has been surprising about this process so far in coming together and thinking about creating something new.

Theo Kayser: I don’t know if I’ve had too many surprises. But I do think your first, or one of your early points there, that we all are coming from this as experienced people. I think it really does maybe shape how we’re doing this or what it looks like. I can just call up this or that Catholic Worker and be like, hey, do you have 10 minutes to explain your property ownership. And they’ll be like, oh yeah, Theo, who I’ve hung out with a bunch of times. Let me tell you about that real quick. So just being able to access that.

But if there’s anyone listening who’s curious about that kind of stuff, the thing is probably a lot of the Catholic Workers would return your email or something. I will, if you want to reach out to me. So I think that does make it different.

But I also think I do think it’s a strength in certain ways that because we’ve all done it, we’re not just coming at this wide-eyed and bushy-tailed kind of thing. We’ve all experienced the shit that can happen, whether it’s difficulty in community or seeing difficult things, because that’s the reality of poverty in the United States and stuff like that. And so I think we know how the difficulties that can be there, but we also know the joys of community and joys of being part of the broader Catholic Worker community. Yeah, again, I’m just really happy to have an awesome team to be doing all of this.

Lindsey Myers: I think one thing that was a surprise, but just exciting as we found out that there’s folks that were trying to start a farm only 30 minutes from us, and they’re now calling themselves a Catholic Worker. They weren’t initially, but then they came to Sugar Creek, and people were like, you are! Name it! Call it out! And so the Ozark Hills, I think is what they’re calling themselves, but just being friends with them, and Shane and Ellen, and we went and visited them and learned about his, you know, he brews his own beer, but also garlic and all the different kinds of garlic, and the joy of that and having them close. Yeah, it’s just been very exciting too, of just someone not that far away is just as interested and curious about this, and you just never know who went on a couple dates with the guy and he’s listening to the podcast and is curious, and I’m like, this is the thing, the movement is beautiful, and it is a gift that keeps giving, and I think just that anyone could get interested, and so I just think that’s awesome, and I love it.

Chrissy Kirkhoeffer: Yeah, yeah, I too was thinking about the Ozark Foothill Catholic Worker Farm, and that was kind of a real great surprise, and just, yeah, trying to make the movement itself more accessible, or the work, and yeah, just also that whole don’t call me a saint, like everybody should be pulled, hopefully everybody would be pulled into this work, you know, and to not make that separation, and we all, so many of us clearly see the needs within our communities, and just how to be empowered, but how we definitely do need community together to do this work, or it definitely has been so nourishing and necessary in my life.

Lydia Wong: So as we sort of wrap things up, other thoughts, lessons, inspirations, words of wisdom you’d like to share?

Lindsey Myers: Yeah, I mean, I guess just that, like, I don’t know, I had a friend one time who was like, Lindsey, why don’t you, like, start a Worker? And I was like, what? But it’s just one of those things of, like, if you’re interested, like, lean into that, like, yeah, it’s just, like, I almost feel overwhelmed with gratitude that I found something that fits so much of my, like, philosophy and way of life that’s, like, I didn’t even know about for a lot of my life, you know? And I just, yeah, just, like, trust in that the Spirit kind of brought us together in this, like, beautiful way, and I think continues to move forward, and yeah, and if you’re out there, and you have a house in St. Louis area, please reach out.

Chrissy Kirkhoeffer: Or if you’re interested in coming to the house, when we can get a house, or in the work, or what have you, most welcome.

I think, yeah, similarly, I’m just thinking about the work and the beauty of the work, and just to know that we’re going to make mistakes along the way, and we’ll probably have some hurt feelings, but not letting that stop us, and just to also try to, you know, get some things in place, but I think really, you know, again, going back to really trusting each other in this process, and trusting that we have this wider community to lean into as well, you know, both in the Catholic Worker Movement and those who have yet to join the Catholic Worker Movement that we hope will, or to join in the work, you know.

Lindsey Myers: Yeah, something that LA in their card that they wrote us that I felt was just, like, every time I hear this, it’s so beautiful, but it’s like, you know, you do something, and you fail, and then you learn, and you do it again, and, like, that’s the beautiful, like, radical imagination, is that, like, we are an experiment, and, like, we’re trusting in the Spirit, and there’s no, like, perfect or right way to do something, but, like, we trust our, like, love for each other, and that this, and that the love of liberation will continue, and the ways we interact with each other in our community, and I think that, you know, we’re trying, and we’re moving forward, but I just think that’s such a good, like, lesson, because sometimes it’s, like, how do I do this? I have to do it the right way, or this only way, but it’s, like, we try, and we fail, and we pray, and we learn, and we, like, do it again, and that’s the work, you know?

Lydia Wong: Theo, what about you? Any final thoughts or final questions? I sort of commandeered asking all of the questions.

Theo Kayser: No, I appreciate it when you do that, Lydia, because your questions are always so much better than mine. No, I don’t really have any final thoughts beyond what I’ve said. I’m happy that there are people excited in making the Catholic Worker happen in St. Louis, which is my hometown, too, if we haven’t mentioned that, and I’m happy that the only two people who are super interested in doing that at the moment are pretty cool people, too. And it was a lot of fun to finally have them come on the podcast here, too, for me.

Lydia Wong: Yeah, thank you, Chrissy and Lindsey, for being willing to jump on here and share a little bit about the process. I think it’d be really fun if, hopefully, the podcast is still going in a year or two to come back and see what the new worker evolves to.

Theo Kayser: Maybe you can come down for the inaugural goat party or something like that. We can do a live episode.

Lydia Wong: Definitely. Goat’s a special guest.

Chrissy Kirkhoeffer: Thanks for having us. Good to be here.

Lindsey Myers: Yeah. It’s a joy that I always get kind of funny about these things, but it is a beautiful gift to talk about our stories and how we got to where we are. It’s beautiful.

Lydia Wong: Huge thanks to Lindsey and Chrissy for joining us. And, of course, Theo, you’re kind of obligated to be here, so you’re just here again. But really enjoyed talking with all of you about this journey to start a new Worker. I always think it’s exciting to hear about new Workers starting.

Theo Kayser: It’s been exciting, and we’ve been lucky to have so many friends coming to join us, too. I wonder whether we’re still in the honeymoon phase. We don’t even have a house yet, right? We all love each other, and it’s going to be such a great community and stuff like that, and I’m sure it will be. But it has been a lot of fun, and it was a lot of fun to be able to have them on the podcast.

Lydia Wong: I think it would actually be really interesting if there’s any other groups of people who are in the process of starting a Catholic Worker to maybe talk with them as well, to kind of compare similar processes of what does it look like when people are exploring starting a Catholic Worker. Your experience, you kind of noted, was a little bit different, because you all have been involved with a Catholic Worker for some time, which I do think is a little bit of a different process compared to people who maybe don’t have those years already of living in other communities.

Theo Kayser: Yeah, that would be fun.

Lydia Wong: Well, hopefully in maybe a year or two, we’ll be able to do an update podcast on where the new Catholic Worker is now. If you want to help support their journey or follow along, get their newsletter, those sorts of things, you can go ahead and look at the show notes, and we’ll put all of the information in there where you can donate and sign up for their newsletter.

[music]

That wraps up another episode for us of Coffee with Catholic Workers. If you want to reach out to us with any comments, suggestions, clarification of thought, you can always email us at coffeewithcatholicworkers@gmail.com. We want to say thanks to Catholic Worker audio engineer Chris, David Hayes for our music, and Becky McIntyre for our graphic. Thank you.

Theo Kayser: Thanks for joining us again for some clarification of thought. We hope today’s conversation and discussions have been enlightening, and maybe even that you’re encouraged to go out and help build a world where it’s easier to be good.

Coffee with Catholic Workers is a podcast by and about Catholic Workers. Every two weeks, join Lydia Wong and Theo Kayser for a conversation with some of their favorite Catholic Worker folk. Special thanks to sound engineer Chris of Bloomington, IN.